Home > NHL > Sox ’04 Banner Tainted? NO

Sox ’04 Banner Tainted? NO

Manny’s steroid use opens up a whole new box of questions, but the biggest one of all deals with a team he’s not on and season five years ago:

Is the 2004 Championship (and 2007 for that matter) he won with the Boston Red Sox tainted?

100% absolutely NO!

NO

NO

NO

NO

AND NO!!

 

I’m a Red Sox fan. I’m biased. Even so, I still can’t see how the 2004 Sox’s playoff run was tainted and here’s why:

  1. Manny is one player. One important player, yes, but one player nonetheless. Pitching wins championship, not hitting. Schilling was  a horse in the playoffs. You remember Dave Roberts’s steal. You remember Schilling’s bloody sock. You remember Papi’s walk off hits. You don’t point to something about Manny specifically. He played well. He hit well, but by no means did he carry the team. With him off steroids, that 2004 Red Sox team would still have won.
  2. Is it really cheating if everyone is doing it? Okay, yes it is, but let’s look at that Yankees’ roster that lost in the ALCS to the Sox in 2004. Alex Rodriguez? Steroids. Gary Sheffield? Steroids. Ruben Sierra? Steroids. Kevin Brown? HGH. Those are the known guys. I don’t doubt that many other players on that team were juicing. That’s not to say anyone else on the Red Sox wasn’ton steroids, but why does Manny taking steroids take anything away from the Red Sox’s playoff run if A-Rod and Sheffield, the Yankees’ sluggers, were both on ‘roids as well? It doesn’t take anything away. The playing field is still even and the Red Sox are still the rightful champions, without an asterisk.
  3. Manny wasn’t actually THAT good in the playoffs. He was good. He was real good in the 2004 postseason, but he was not unstoppable. Batting average? .350. On-Base-Percentage? .423. Those are pretty great. Yet, Manny had just two home runs and struck out eleven times. He had just five extra-base hits, but 16 singles. Tell me this, how much do steroids help on singles? If he wasn’t on steroids, he’s still hitting those steroids and probably those home runs (I dont’ know their distances unfortunately). Steroids didn’t make Manny hit well in that postseason, because Manny didn’t hit for power in the 2004 playoffs. Manny made Manny hit those singles, because Manny was born to hit and steroids just added slightly to that. His steroid use doesn’t change a thing.

That’s all pretty straight forward. So far, no player’s steroid use has caused anyone to doubt a team’s success. Keyword: team. Teams win. Players just make up a team and Manny was one player. This shouldn’t even be a debate: The 2004 Boston Red Sox were, are, and forever will be champions.

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Categories: NHL
  1. TiredofAll This
    May 8, 2009 at 3:50 pm

    Not a RedSox fan here…but you forgot a couple numbers.

    4. Curt Schilling’s bloody sock…yeah. Remember he got cortisone shots in his ankle during the playoffs? You do…? Were you also aware that cortisone is a STEROID? But that’s okay, because we knew about it, right? To me, *that* was cheating. He was unable to pitch without it, thus it enhanced his performance, and is a known steroid.

    5. Manny passed quite a few MLB administered drug tests in 2004-2008. His failure on a drug test in 2009 does NOT mean he was ‘using’ back then.

    • May 10, 2009 at 4:38 pm

      Cortisone is a steroids, but it’s not an anabolic steroid. Anabolic steroids are used in cycles to build muscle. A cortisone shot is used to rehab from an injury quicker and is commonly used by atheltes and non-athletes alike. It’s like a strong version of advil. However, it is a steroid nonetheless and one can make the argument that it is cheating. I don’t think it gives a player an unfair advantage so I don’t consider it cheating

      Manny did pass drug tests though those are unreliable as the chemists are always ahead of the testers. Since there is the slightest chance he was clean in 2004, that reinforces my point that 2004 banner isn’t tainted. I can’t see how he wasn’t on steroids, but even if he was, the title is still not tainted.

  2. Omari Parker
    May 9, 2009 at 9:06 pm

    A couple things…

    The ALCS in 04 was an AMAZING comeback that had more to do with late inning heroics than pitching. Without those heroics, the efforts of your pitching staff would’ve been futile.

    Also, I see you included Manny’s AVG (.350), OBP (.423), and hits breakdown… You’re right, steroids don’t help you with those things, but you can’t say he wasn’t THAT good. I noticed you left out a couple stats.. How many RBI did he have? How many runs scored? How many times did he get rallies going? Those stats will tell you more of his worth than AVG and OBP.

    Don’t forget that Manny WAS the MVP of the World Series. I noticed you left that out too. St. Louis was a phenominal ballclub that year and your guys picked them apart like nothing. I don’t remember the scores or remember his stats, but I do know that without Manny, it woulda been a totally different series. Like facing that Cardinal lineup without Pujols.

    Do I think he was using then, No. BUT, I don’t think BOS woulda swept that STL team without him. Who knows what woulda happened.

    GO DODGERS!

    • May 10, 2009 at 4:53 pm

      He had 11 RBI and 8 runs during the 2004 playoffs. Very Good? Absolutely. The difference between winning and not winning? No. I can’t tell you how many times he started a rally, but I can tell you a rally requires more than one player to hit.

      Without Manny, the Sox would have won the 2004 World Series in five games at most. I’d say likely still be a sweep. There was one offensive game in the series and it was the first one where Boston won 11-9. Manny had a great game, going 3 for 5 with 2 RBIs. He made 2 errors in the game though and left 4 guys on base. If you replace him with a medium player do the Sox win? Maybe I’d say. Remember, St. Louis pitchers had an awful day so a medium-level player could pick them apart as well. In the other the games, St. Louis scored a COMBINED three runs. Manny wasn’t the reason the Sox won any of those; it was Boston’s pitching. Thanks for the comment

  3. A-Roid
    May 25, 2009 at 9:52 pm

    THe world series isn’t tainted but the Red Sox would not have won the World Series or ALCS without Manny.Look at how he effected Ortiz in that lineup.

    .Ortiz(not far from a clean player) only was great fromm Manny.

    Manny has the most homeruns ever in post-season history.The HcG he took masks steroids cyles so he can get away with taking steroids or HGH or testeriones.

    The day you Red Sox fans can prove Brosius,Mariano,Derek Jeter and Welld took steroids can any of our championships be taken.

    • June 8, 2009 at 4:09 pm

      Why was Ortiz great only from Manny? Yes, he is horrible now, but that is not necessarily because Manny isn’t in the lineup. In the 3 spot, Ortiz was still surrounded by Jason Bay, Kevin Youkilis, and the reigning AL MVP Dustin Pedroia. His hitting hasn’t declined, because Manny isn’t batting behind him. Ortiz is just old and has lost bat speed

      Would you be that surprised to hear that Brosius, Jeter, Rivera, or Wells used steroids? There isn’t anyone out that there is beyond suspicion and I wouldn’t be shocked at any name. It’s the sad truth about baseball.

  4. May 17, 2017 at 10:38 am

    I tried this one and I like it! It was fairly easy and straight forward. I tweaked some things a little the way I liked them, but, otwihrese, I followed pretty much what you had written. I liked the poster as you did it and saw no reason to change much.I put it up on my , if you want to see!I had fun with this! Thank you!Su

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